Looks like I might actually be selling this x850XT PE sooner than I first thought.. Looks like the x1800 AGP is coming, -again!..

Quote: Originally Posted by konai_konai666 Looks like I might actually be selling this x850XT PE sooner than I first thought.. Looks like the x1800 AGP is coming, -again!..

woo-hoo!

Why upgrade to a PCI-e system when graphics card vendors keep making our lives simple? (Yes expensive ...)

-godling

Wouldnt it be bottlenecked by AGP's bandwidth?

No..even 8x AGP was never fully used by previous generations of cards, this X-1800 may be getting a bit closer to the limit, but I'm sure they wouldn't have bothered with AGP if it realy held back the performance of there flagship card!

So why the hell did we go to PCI express? Could we have done SLI with AGP?

Quote: Originally Posted by Nerdz So why the hell did we go to PCI express? Could we have done SLI with AGP?

Absolutely! The original SLI interface (see VoodooII cards of yore) was done on (normal) PCI slots before AGP even came out.

-godling

Don't forget that there was a dual-AGP system before nVidia's SLI, too..

Quote: Originally Posted by Nerdz So why the hell did we go to PCI express? Could we have done SLI with AGP?

Yes but PCI-E offers more bandwidth. SLI on AGP would have worked but PCI-E has more bandwidth to play with. Currently sli uses two PCI-E 16x slots running each at 8x. In the future there are going to be more boards with two 16x PCI-E slots that can have both cards at 16x which means more bandwidth. The crossfire chips and the nvidia chips that are being worked on right now will get ride of the need for the sli bridge and dvi connector for crossfire due to the extra bandwidth that will be available with two 16x slots running at 16x simultaneously. **Note with the latest Nvidia drivers SLI is able to be run without the sli bridge but it also does take away from some of the bandwidth. Which means when runnning a bench or game like 3D Mark 05 you will get a couple hundred points less or a couple FPS less because of the extra bandwidth used by using SLI without the SLI bridge.**

So wait your saying is because of that little card connector thing that connects the 2 card together only allows the cards to work at 8X each rather than 16X Alone?

But wouldnt 1 Card running at 16X be better than running 2 at 8X each?

Quote: Originally Posted by Nerdz So wait your saying is because of that little card connector thing that connects the 2 card together only allows the cards to work at 8X each rather than 16X Alone? But wouldnt 1 Card running at 16X be better than running 2 at 8X each?

No the chipset limits the cards to runnint at 8x. No because the cards currently dont use all of the 8x bandwith but with the next gen of motherboard chipsets (ATI and Nvidia) will allow both cards to run at a full 16x at the same time and doing this will give it enough bandwith to get ride of the sli connector without hurting performance as well as getting rid of ATIs little dongle for crossfire.

Quote: Originally Posted by konai_konai666 Don't forget that there was a dual-AGP system before nVidia's SLI, too..

I must see this. AGP was never designed for multiple GPU's. This is why every dual-GPU AGP card has blown balls. there were more than one built, and not just from 3dfx. see XGI Volari V8.

I hate to break this to ya guys. this has been gone over on so many forums its not funny. It seems like the agp version of this card was a webmasters screw up on the diamond site.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/d...117122745.html

*double post*
They DO have a poll on their homepage regarding the use of AGP flavour 1800s and 7800s. If we all truley want this card (Im indifferent) then I suggest you make your voice heard somewhere. Or maybe we could start some kind of movment hear at pimprig urging a manufacturer to creat a new agp version.
all it takes is the pcie-agp bridge already being used on the x800xl and x800gto.
Hope is not lost, we all just have to work for it.

what would be the point?

if i have a porshe that can do 200mph but i put on tires that only can handle 80 mph... why not buy a toyota that does 80mph and save some$$


would you spend 300$ on a card that preforms the same as a 100$ one?

remember that AGP8X is perfectly fine for most games. In fact, even for professional CAD work, there's only two cards that I know of that's commerically available that uses the PCIe interface.

Everything else still uses the AGP8X standard, which begs the question - if pro cards don't need it, why should consumer cards use it?

Also note that the "increase" in bandwidth comes as a result of lower latencies, and routing.

The only cards that I know of that can fully saturate the PCIe interface (x16 and dual x16) are currently prototypes right now, some of which have implemented technologies similar to the Opterons, and some of them have switched to mram, and the use of HyperTransport.

Although I haven't conducted tests myself, but I would be more than willing to bet that the performance gain you get from PCIe isn't as much as you think you would.

Quote: Originally Posted by THRiLL KiLL what would be the point? if i have a porshe that can do 200mph but i put on tires that only can handle 80 mph... why not buy a toyota that does 80mph and save some$$ Q: would you spend 300$ on a card that preforms the same as a 100$ one?

A: " Yes, I definately would." , being that it was a worthwhile enough investment and my processor/ mainboard was more than a year old and/ or 32-bit of any sort..

IMO, -You have some valid points here......
but a $100 card just doesnt perform the same as a $200+ one in any instance (atleast without serious OC's, voltmods, and/ or rebates and price-cuts) (atleast in my very recent personal 3dMk2k1 testing of a 9800se vs 9200 in a PII 350MHz)..

its alot cheaper to upgrade just the vid card then the vid card + mobo in one shot.

and the asus board that lets both slots be 16x in sli, means that it provides a total of 32x. i dont see any performance gain in any game out now or in the first half of next years that can utilize this.

like having a indy car on a gravel road. WHY!!!!

Quote: Originally Posted by THRiLL KiLL what would be the point? if i have a porshe that can do 200mph but i put on tires that only can handle 80 mph... why not buy a toyota that does 80mph and save some$$ would you spend 300$ on a card that preforms the same as a 100$ one?

That's not how it works. The X1800 doesn't use enough bandwidth to be bottlenecked by the AGP bus. Do you realize how fast the AGP bus really is? They made PCI-E for future purposes and SLI/Crossfire.

Quote: Originally Posted by turbopsi That's not how it works. The X1800 doesn't use enough bandwidth to be bottlenecked by the AGP bus. Do you realize how fast the AGP bus really is? They made PCI-E for future purposes and SLI/Crossfire.

Yup, just one more reason not up upgrade to the new platorm.