Arkangyl

MDK, you're talking about the AGP apature size, which is user selectable, I have a 256mb card and 512mb RAM but I only have a 64mb Apature (apature RAM is system RAM set aside for the video card to use as overflow)

micronx

hey know what just keep your 9700 and wait till you get enuf to upgrade it later on...i mean with pci-e and everything and Ati is supposed to come out with SLi soon at more resonable prices for a pair of 2 cards.... my 9800 256 card can play any current game and 3dmarks is jus braggin rights really.

Arkangyl

micronx, ATI is slated to release their Sli equivalent mid to late 2005. Also their cards will not be cheaper, if ATI produced their SLi right now a pair of X800 Pro's would cost $800ish (2 x $400).

Also I had a 9800 np 128mb which I flashed with an XT BIOS and had a 440 / 780. It ran games just fine. Then I got a 6800 Ultra (440, 1.22) and I dont think I could go back to the 9800 Pro.

The difference from a 9700 Pro to a 6800 GT-E (for example) would be the difference between HL2 @ 800x600 with stuff on medium to 1280x1074 with everything maxxed and some filtering, trust me its a whole new game at that level. Also consider that 6800 GT-E will be SLi'able for up to double the performance, also the gap will widen down the road between those two cards.

SpikeShot

9700 pro plays HL2 just fine at 1024 res. with medium to high setting depending on your CPU and other system components.

Right now I think an upgrade would be with the PCI-E line from Nvidia. You can purchase an Asus SLI board now, with a 6800 GT card, 1 gig Crucial balistix ram, and AMD 3200+ 939 Winchester core 90 nm.
That puts your CPU@2.7 gigs, and the abiltiy to double the GPU performance when the 6800 GT's go down to 250-300 dollar range in second quarter 2005.

If you do go ATI, its the XT for nothing when it comes to the older cards. With the new refresh cards, which I think are a waste of time and money, you can be ok going with a X/850 pro chip because it to also has 16 pipelines and just runs abit cooler because the core and ram is slower.

I got an X/800 XT PCI-E, and I think i would still purchase this card over an nvivda card even though i am geting SLI in no more than 2 months. I know that the Nvidia cards are long, and they block all kinds of things in cases. I run 4 SATA HD's and I would only be able to run 2 if I did get an SLI rig.

ATI is comming out with their muti-GPU support crap, and i am sure it wil not be as good a nvidia's, but close.

If you are making a move now go with PCI-E Nvidia 6800 GT and a new SLI rig.

If you don't want to upgrade completly, then I would go with the ATI X/800 XT, the older one, or try to find a AGP XL X/800. If you don't got the cash, the 6600 GT is the king. The X/600 is crap, and the X/700 is also crap considering the cards mentioned above.

I have the cash to move to SLI now, but I am holding on another upgrade as I am just got this new intel system on the test bench and I am just waiting for a RMA from ASUS. Working on something for PR, and this system is in it. But, right now I am out of my PC, and have been for a good week. Sucks to considering its Xmas and I have alot of PC work to catch up on, like Need For Speed Underground 2 and HL2.

EDIT...one last thing.

if you do get a Pro, don't try to unlock the extra 4 pipes as strange things begin to happen. Although some will not unlock the pipes, it may give you a higher OC with the core and ram, but you take the risk of opening up the extra broken pipes and having major issues. ATI will not replace these cards, and they are testing now a days.

Furthermore, the Ultra line and GT line both have 16 pipelines, the difference is that the 6800 ultra are toping out at 470 core and the GT are 430.

I have read many negative things happening when people have tryied to unlock a regular 6800 to a GT, so again I would not try it unless you can afford the 400 to get another card.

toastyghost

Quote: Originally Posted by ShoRyukEn Personally, I'd go by what the NewEgg reviews say, but the X800 card doesn't have any. I've heard alot of good things about the X800 but I've never heard anything about Powercolor, nor XFX. If it were really up to me, I'd go with the X800 based on looks and the software it comes with (CS:CZ is a decent game ). I also noticed that the accessories for the 6800 GT state that it comes with "drivers" and the X800 comes with the drivers CD. I'm not sure if that means they come preinstalled on the 6800 GT or not, but having the driver CD's is always a plus in my book. Edit: The system power requirements are also lower for the X800 X800 all the way.

First of all, DUDE YOURE ****ING ON CRACK YES YOUR VIDEO CARD COMES WITHOUT A CD AND IS PREINSTALLED WITH DRIVERS ON THE CARD SINCE THOSE HAVE TO BE ON THE ****ING HARD DRIVE YOU RETARD OF COURSE IT MEANS A CD

With that out of the way, all you need to know is that 16 pixel pipes > 12 pixel pipes. End of story. If you have $400 to spend you're better off with a GT. If cost is a concern, get a vanilla 6800 or a V9999.

droeblek9

Quote: Originally Posted by toastyghost First of all, DUDE YOURE ****ING ON CRACK YES YOUR VIDEO CARD COMES WITHOUT A CD AND IS PREINSTALLED WITH DRIVERS ON THE CARD SINCE THOSE HAVE TO BE ON THE ****ING HARD DRIVE YOU RETARD OF COURSE IT MEANS A CD With that out of the way, all you need to know is that 16 pixel pipes > 12 pixel pipes. End of story. If you have $400 to spend you're better off with a GT. If cost is a concern, get a vanilla 6800 or a V9999.

You make a good point about pipelines.

Lighten up on Sho: he's a nice guy and didn't deserve that.

M.D.K.

SLI? I thought the OP wanted an AGP part so he wouldnt have to replace his whole rig. SLI is the obvious choice if you're building a whole new computer, cause hey in a year or so when yours isnt as fast as the newer stuff, all you gotta do is throw in annother one for twice the fun.

If you're sticking with AGP though? Honestly with a 9700+ I'd hold out till I could afford an SLI setup. If you absolutely cant wait, the 6600 (256mb) is a great performer for $200. You should be running just about anything as highly detailed as you want, assuming you arent too cpu-limited.

SpikeShot

You will be able to run 1024-1280 res. with medium setting with HL2, and 1280 with high setting for games like Doom 3.

I think it is a good card, but geting any AGP card now would be a waste of money if upgrading your system is going to be in short future.

O and happy Xmas to all.

Quote: Originally Posted by M.D.K. SLI? I thought the OP wanted an AGP part so he wouldnt have to replace his whole rig. SLI is the obvious choice if you're building a whole new computer, cause hey in a year or so when yours isnt as fast as the newer stuff, all you gotta do is throw in annother one for twice the fun. If you're sticking with AGP though? Honestly with a 9700+ I'd hold out till I could afford an SLI setup. If you absolutely cant wait, the 6600 (256mb) is a great performer for $200. You should be running just about anything as highly detailed as you want, assuming you arent too cpu-limited.

Arkangyl

Well Spike, that depends.

Here's the 4-1-1;

In late 2005 AMD and Intel will release dual-core CPU's, those CPU's will require a new motherboard and if you're still on a 9700 Pro chances are you're not an often upgrader so you won't be getting a s939 now and a dual core mobo & CPU later.

That means you're probably doing one of two things;

A; sticking with AGP until dual-core CPU's; in this case its a tossup, the 9700 Pro will play the games between now and late 2005 but honestly you'll be missing alot. In this case a 6600 GT will give a nice 30% boost in performance for $200 whereas a 6800 GT will give about a 50% boost for $400 or just under (those performance numbers are potential increases, you will not go down).

B; getting a new CPU & Mobo with s939; get an SLi capable board with a 90nm CPU and a 6600 GT (30% boost now, $200 per, 50% with SLi) or a 6800 GT (50% boost now, $400-500 per ATM, 85% with SLi) or wait till Febuary and get an X800 XL (16 pipes but far lower clocks then an XT PE, $300) and see what ATI comes up with

SpikeShot

Well Ark here is the 4-2-2

Intel is allready got working samples of the "new" dual core CPU's, which right now are just 2 90NM "E" cores running in lower speeds with a bridged connection, plus added L-2 cache and full support for 64 bit computing. They ARE socket LGA 775, and will most likley remain in that socket type as it is a very nice design, plus everything is still new. I allready have a LGA 775 board, and it should be a direct replacement in mid-late second quarter 2005, might need a BIOS flash or something minor.

it also seems AMD is going to be using the Socket 939 for a good while longer as well, but kiss good-bye the 754 socket. The socket 940 is also staying, and is not a bad option if you got one of the original FX-51 CPUs.

If AMD does switch to a different socket, they will be going to Intel for the design because Intel's new socket design is PIMP. Now i know it has its isues with the mobo makers and the fact that you can only take it out "25" times or so (which is crap), but I think it is one of the best things that has come out in 2004.

The bad part is that these new CPUs are not going to be that impressive until Longhorn comes out in 2006. By then you may need all that power to run a nifty program called looking glass...already on Linux and it rocks. Do a google search on this program, you can get it for Windows but it is buggy.

If it is anything like dual core Xeons it is going to be stopped by any P.4 now running around 4 gigs when it comes to things that we use are chips for, the gaming and benchmarks. I am not looking forward to this as much as I am looking forward to DDR-3 and 512 meg ATI cards running in SLI, that makes 1 gig shared ram. Also SATA 300 mb, the new "E: Intel line with 2 meg cache instead of one.

Upgrading has never been better in my opinion. You have so many good options right now its unreal.

The bottom line....

-If you got a older AMD XP system and you want another year, get a 6600 GT.
-If you got a newer system with a crappy old 5200, then get a 6800 GT and be done.
-if you got a POS PC running a Intel P.2@500 MZh, then a new system with SLI and PCI-E is a good option then.
-If you are like me and have to have the best of everything, then SLI is the only way to go right now.

Arkangyl

Crist Spike, ATI vs nVidia, Intel vs. AMD

can we agree on anything? :p

Highperf15

Quote: Originally Posted by SpikeShot it also seems AMD is going to be using the Socket 939 for a good while longer as well, but kiss good-bye the 754 socket. The socket 940 is also staying, and is not a bad option if you got one of the original FX-51 CPUs. If AMD does switch to a different socket, they will be going to Intel for the design because Intel's new socket design is PIMP. Now i know it has its isues with the mobo makers and the fact that you can only take it out "25" times or so (which is crap), but I think it is one of the best things that has come out in 2004.

Actually, AMD said the 754 is going to stay, at least awhile as they will be introducing more Semprons to the market......... http://the-inquirer.net/?article=20308

As for AMD using a Intel design socket, I don't think that will ever happen since Intel is trying to play catch-up in the multi-core market.