5900-5950: anybody done this?

KayinStorm · 18-June-04, 04:31 PM

I know GK did it, but I wonder if anyone else has...

I want to flash my card, and I haven't done an nVidia before. Anyone wanna tell me how to do it? Sorry, some things I'm not too experienced in... I just need to know what t entails...

CRE · 18-June-04, 05:39 PM

Well, the first thing is do you have a FX5900 non-Ultra or a FX5900XT? The important difference is that the XT specs call for nothing more than 2.8ns RAM (max 714MHz clocked at 700MHz) versus the NU's 2.2ns RAM (clocked at 950MHz in a 5950U or 850MHz in a FX5900 non-Ultra)... If your RAM can clock that high (it may require flashing with a BIOS which disables throttling) then you can most likely flash with a standard 5950U BIOS. Otherwise you'll need to use a modified version of the BIOS with lower base settings.

Here are some very good links for reference:

5950U flashing:
http://www.cluboverclocker.com/guides/5900_Flash_Mod/
http://forums.extremeoverclocking.co...d.php?t=103718
http://www.explosivelabs.com/forums/...=&threadid=913

5900XT Flashing:
http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread....hreadid=85394/

Good overall info regarding the process and differences between the two:
http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread....threadid=77480
http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread....0&pagenumber=1

Here for moded BIOS (down at the moment of this post due to bandwidth restriction):
http://www.mvktech.net/download.php

I myself am awaiting the delivery of two FX5900XT's.... I'm at least gonna use a modded BIOS. Without it most 5900 cards,of any series, won't O/C very well due to limitations set in the BIOS (see: throttling).

KayinStorm · 18-June-04, 06:10 PM

I have a real 5900 Ultra, not an non or an XT. Just wanted to get the most I could from it. I'll be pulling the sinks pretty soon to figure it out...

I'll hopefully post tonight on what memory I have...

CRE · 18-June-04, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KayinStorm


	I have a real 5900 Ultra, not an non or an XT. Just wanted to get the most I could from it. I'll be pulling the sinks pretty soon to figure it out... I'll hopefully post tonight on what memory I have...

Sigh..... If i didn't badly need to upgrade my wife's vid card as well that's what I would have probably gotten. That's ok, I'm sure we'll both be very pleased with the XT's. I'm still running a Ti4200 and she's only got a FX5200.

Anyway, from what I've read about how many of the 5900 series are constrained by BIOS controlled throttling, you may see your high end O/C improve without any other changes needed. Pity they decided they needed to implement such a restriction. So, I'd go for it, you can always flash back if it doesn't improve things though. You may want to try a couple different BIOS though. From what i've read there's a difference in the voltage depending on whether the RAM's Samsung or Hynix..... using a BIOS from a card with the opposite RAM as your card can result in MUCH weaker results than prior to the flash.

Lemme know how it goes.

KayinStorm · 19-June-04, 12:38 AM

Starts with HY, so I'm assuming Hynix...

CRE · 19-June-04, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KayinStorm


	Starts with HY, so I'm assuming Hynix...

Yup, damned good RAM, usually O/Cs very well. Does it have the designation AF-22 written on the chip? 22 = 2.2ns, 25 = 2.5ns and 28 = 2.8ns. It should be 2.2ns, but I've read of a few with 2.5ns RAM.

KayinStorm · 19-June-04, 12:50 AM

have to pull it again...

The best question is, how much more performance should I expect?

CRE · 19-June-04, 01:01 AM

AFAIK, the 2.2ns will almost always overreach the 1GHz mark. With Hynix a large number of people can even get the 2.8ns up to around 1GHz..... God, please bless my cards with your gift to the Computer Geek known as Hynix RAM.

Anyway, with a modified 5950U BIOS you may be able to relax the latencies to get an even higher clock speed out of them.... but, from what I've read, the 5950U's and 5900U's have pretty relaxed latencies as it is.

Depending on what card you're using you may not need a modified 5950U BIOS at all. Throttling is the main reason for using a modified BIOS. It does seem that cards without thermal monitoring don't throttle down when pushed. MSI FX5900XT's for example.

This link (although intended for FX5900XT owners) gives some very good info: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/faq.html

TekXoID · 19-June-04, 01:02 AM

Kayin, Check THIS out.

CRE · 19-June-04, 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TekXoID


	Kayin, Check THIS* out.*

The one thing I'd keep an eye out for is that apparently the Samsung RAM and the Hynix RAM use different voltages which are controlled in the BIOS. Using the BIOS from a card with the lower vDimm on the one which requires more can result in worse performance than prior to the flash.

Please note: This is only what I have read from the posts and observations of others in the many links in my prior post. Regardless, sticking with a BIOS for a card with the same make of RAM is the best bet for reliability.

BigAkita · 19-June-04, 01:29 AM

OK, you got me to thinkin' which isn't an easy task. I flashed the generic 5900xt Bios first, then the Gainward Bios. Then I selected my driver as the 5950 Ultra and it loaded with no problem at 350 and 800. I have already killed that with my OC's so I loaded the latest Omega drivers. Then went back through the rigamaroll of making it look like a 5950 Ultra again, and my default speeds are 450/900. Not bad, I ran AquaMark 3 at 40,771 with my defaults.

What did I gain performance-wise? Nothing. I could beat that score by OCing out of the box. But, I did get a chance to flash the bios a few times, load a few different versions of drivers, and get performance right out of the box WITHOUT overclocking (intentionally) to end up with a real 5950U. I've punched it a couple times since then but am still careful at the redline.

So what's the bottom line? My Gainward Golden Sample card easily became a Gainward 5950U and runs now at a default of 450/900 for free. If I were to post any specs from any program, it will read "Gainward 5950 Ultra". Now I just need to figure out how much higher this already out of spec card can go. Ya'll saw my previous thread about this card, you may see more with the bios I have in it.

KayinStorm · 19-June-04, 01:32 AM

Oh, so now if I wanna beat you I have to flash mine too?

dangit.

CRE · 19-June-04, 01:40 AM

Hey BA, do you know what RAM that Gainward has? I'm just curious. I'm interested in what speed and make.

Edit: Yeah, some people don't get any higher overclock rates, but some people can't get any higher until after the BIOS flash. Oh, and isn't the 5950U's GPU clocked at 475MHz by default?

Edit: And which Gainward GS model do you have?

BigAkita · 19-June-04, 04:51 PM

If memory serves the memory is Hynix 2.8. It's the 1100XT card. I've been running some games on it and haven't had any problems with "CPU Throttling" that I've seen some other folks have problems with. CPU Throttling is when the vid card freezes for a couple of seconds to keep the framerates within limits. Still rock steady at 450/900, I haven't pushed it any higher yet.

BigAkita · 19-June-04, 05:58 PM

OK, OK...I know this is a double post.

I found a better 5950U bios, it's a true bios instead of a modded one. I have my card running comfortably now at 475/925. Here's a couple of screenies:

Digital-World · 19-June-04, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KayinStorm


	have to pull it again... The best question is, how much more performance should I expect?

Isn't your luck bad enough just from touching your hardware let alone trying to flash it?
Could be me but you trying to mod that card might result in yet another Rest In Peace thread from you this week

Play Safe
Digi

18-June-04, 05:39 PM	#2 (permalink)
CRE Apex Tech Maniac Supreme Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 1,057	Well, the first thing is do you have a FX5900 non-Ultra or a FX5900XT? The important difference is that the XT specs call for nothing more than 2.8ns RAM (max 714MHz clocked at 700MHz) versus the NU's 2.2ns RAM (clocked at 950MHz in a 5950U or 850MHz in a FX5900 non-Ultra)... If your RAM can clock that high (it may require flashing with a BIOS which disables throttling) then you can most likely flash with a standard 5950U BIOS. Otherwise you'll need to use a modified version of the BIOS with lower base settings. Here are some very good links for reference: 5950U flashing: http://www.cluboverclocker.com/guides/5900_Flash_Mod/ http://forums.extremeoverclocking.co...d.php?t=103718 http://www.explosivelabs.com/forums/...=&threadid=913 5900XT Flashing: http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread....hreadid=85394/ Good overall info regarding the process and differences between the two: http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread....threadid=77480 http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread....0&pagenumber=1 Here for moded BIOS (down at the moment of this post due to bandwidth restriction): http://www.mvktech.net/download.php I myself am awaiting the delivery of two FX5900XT's.... I'm at least gonna use a modded BIOS. Without it most 5900 cards,of any series, won't O/C very well due to limitations set in the BIOS (see: throttling). __________________ "I intend to die as a happy man, but am not quite ready to live as one..." Glen Phillips

19-June-04, 01:01 AM	#8 (permalink)
CRE Apex Tech Maniac Supreme Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 1,057	AFAIK, the 2.2ns will almost always overreach the 1GHz mark. With Hynix a large number of people can even get the 2.8ns up to around 1GHz..... God, please bless my cards with your gift to the Computer Geek known as Hynix RAM. Anyway, with a modified 5950U BIOS you may be able to relax the latencies to get an even higher clock speed out of them.... but, from what I've read, the 5950U's and 5900U's have pretty relaxed latencies as it is. Depending on what card you're using you may not need a modified 5950U BIOS at all. Throttling is the main reason for using a modified BIOS. It does seem that cards without thermal monitoring don't throttle down when pushed. MSI FX5900XT's for example. This link (although intended for FX5900XT owners) gives some very good info: http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/faq.html __________________ "I intend to die as a happy man, but am not quite ready to live as one..." Glen Phillips

19-June-04, 01:29 AM	#11 (permalink)
BigAkita n00b-ass reviewer Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Nirvana Posts: 14,317	OK, you got me to thinkin' which isn't an easy task. I flashed the generic 5900xt Bios first, then the Gainward Bios. Then I selected my driver as the 5950 Ultra and it loaded with no problem at 350 and 800. I have already killed that with my OC's so I loaded the latest Omega drivers. Then went back through the rigamaroll of making it look like a 5950 Ultra again, and my default speeds are 450/900. Not bad, I ran AquaMark 3 at 40,771 with my defaults. What did I gain performance-wise? Nothing. I could beat that score by OCing out of the box. But, I did get a chance to flash the bios a few times, load a few different versions of drivers, and get performance right out of the box WITHOUT overclocking (intentionally) to end up with a real 5950U. I've punched it a couple times since then but am still careful at the redline. So what's the bottom line? My Gainward Golden Sample card easily became a Gainward 5950U and runs now at a default of 450/900 for free. If I were to post any specs from any program, it will read "Gainward 5950 Ultra". Now I just need to figure out how much higher this already out of spec card can go. Ya'll saw my previous thread about this card, you may see more with the bios I have in it. __________________ "I'll stop being an A-Hole if you will stop being an Idiot."

19-June-04, 01:40 AM	#13 (permalink)
CRE Apex Tech Maniac Supreme Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 1,057	Hey BA, do you know what RAM that Gainward has? I'm just curious. I'm interested in what speed and make. Edit: Yeah, some people don't get any higher overclock rates, but some people can't get any higher until after the BIOS flash. Oh, and isn't the 5950U's GPU clocked at 475MHz by default? Edit: And which Gainward GS model do you have? __________________ "I intend to die as a happy man, but am not quite ready to live as one..." Glen Phillips Last edited by CRE; 19-June-04 at 01:54 AM.

19-June-04, 04:51 PM	#14 (permalink)
BigAkita n00b-ass reviewer Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Nirvana Posts: 14,317	If memory serves the memory is Hynix 2.8. It's the 1100XT card. I've been running some games on it and haven't had any problems with "CPU Throttling" that I've seen some other folks have problems with. CPU Throttling is when the vid card freezes for a couple of seconds to keep the framerates within limits. Still rock steady at 450/900, I haven't pushed it any higher yet. __________________ "I'll stop being an A-Hole if you will stop being an Idiot."

19-June-04, 01:02 AM	#9 (permalink)
TekXoID Banned Join Date: May 2003 Location: looking for love in the nearest gay bar Posts: 4,089	Kayin, Check THIS out.

19-June-04, 05:58 PM	#15 (permalink)
BigAkita n00b-ass reviewer Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Nirvana Posts: 14,317	OK, OK...I know this is a double post. I found a better 5950U bios, it's a true bios instead of a modded one. I have my card running comfortably now at 475/925. Here's a couple of screenies: Attached Thumbnails __________________ "I'll stop being an A-Hole if you will stop being an Idiot."

19-June-04, 08:27 PM	#17 (permalink)
KayinStorm Apex Tech God Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Alithir... Posts: 3,353