Hey ya'll,

So I got my new toy, a PowerColor X1950Pro. Installation was fairly painless, and it runs perfectly. But there's where the fun ends... I ordered this card expecting a slight bottleneck on behalf of the processor. My old and dated socket 754 AMD 3000+ is having quite a hard time keeping up with the new videocard... and the bottleneck is so bad in fact, that my 3Dmark03 score actually dropped ~1200 points after upgrading from my X800XT!!! However, there is still a noticeable positive change in performance in gameplay... though not as noticable as it should be.

I can find AMD 3700+ procs on ebay for around $50 if I'm lucky. So here's my question: Would it be worth my time to upgrade my processor? Does anyone here on PCA have an AMD 3700+ lying around? Upgrading the mobo and socket together is out of the question I'm affraid, unless I can find a 939 combo for ~$200 or less...

So any help is greatly appreciated here guys and gals... and thanks in advance!!!

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Quote: Originally Posted by Jobistober Hey ya'll, So I got my new toy, a PowerColor X1950Pro. Installation was fairly painless, and it runs perfectly. But there's where the fun ends... I ordered this card expecting a slight bottleneck on behalf of the processor. My old and dated socket 754 AMD 3000+ is having quite a hard time keeping up with the new videocard... and the bottleneck is so bad in fact, that my 3Dmark03 score actually dropped ~1200 points after upgrading from my X800XT!!! However, there is still a noticeable positive change in performance in gameplay... though not as noticable as it should be. I can find AMD 3700+ procs on ebay for around $50 if I'm lucky. So here's my question: Would it be worth my time to upgrade my processor? Does anyone here on PCA have an AMD 3700+ lying around? Upgrading the mobo and socket together is out of the question I'm affraid, unless I can find a 939 combo for ~$200 or less... So any help is greatly appreciated here guys and gals... and thanks in advance!!!

Sorry to here that how much are you willing to spend on a AMD 3700+ i look around for you and see if i can find one for you.

Well, considering how utterly dead socket 754 is, I would say 80-100 bucks is my limit I'm willing to spend on a proc. I just searched around for cheap 939/Am2 combos, but I'm just not very willing to basically built an entirely different machine for an AGP videocard... know what I mean?

And thanks ranger!

Quote: Originally Posted by Jobistober Well, considering how utterly dead socket 754 is, I would say 80-100 bucks is my limit I'm willing to spend on a proc. I just searched around for cheap 939/Am2 combos, but I'm just not very willing to basically built an entirely different machine for an AGP videocard... know what I mean? And thanks ranger!

Well i did find one for right now, not sure if you want to spend this amount for it. but here is the link to it plus i am not sure if this is what your looking for hope it helps if not will keep looking.

And i agree with you i am just starting to get stuff for my DFI mobo myself.

Im waiting to upgrade just like you are. Im waiting to see results on AMD's new Quad Core...Im hoping they wont disappoint!.

AM2 does have AGP support, but there are very few mobos around. I was going to upgrade, but I dont want to venture into PCIE yet.

Some AMD motherboard cpu bundles:
Abit NF-M2S NVIDIA Socket AM2 MicroATX Motherboard and an AMD Athlon 64 X2 3600+ 2.0GHz Processor with Fan (Retail) $139
Asus A8N-SLI SE NVIDIA Socket 939 ATX Motherboard and an AMD Athlon 64 X2 3800+ 2.0GHz Dual-Core PC OEM Processor $169


Thats just few examples theres plenty more under 200 bucks

@Nerdz - Yeah, I'm with ya on waiting on Pci-e for a little longer. And that's exactly why I bought this x1950 in hopes to prolong the usefullness of my rig for another year or so until I graduate college... unfortunately, I grossly underestimated the bottlenecking effect my proc would have on this card.

@Beetle - Thanks for the bundles, but unfortunately, they're both PCI-e combos... I'm looking for AGP. Though I was looking around on eBay and found a 939 mobo/cpu combo that features both pci-e AND AGP! And is bundled with an X2 4000+.... so I'm thinking that one over.

Newegg.com - AMD Athlon 64 X2 3600+ Windsor 2.0GHz 2 x 256KB L2 Cache Socket AM2 Processor - Retail

Newegg.com - ASRock 939Dual-VSTA Socket 939 ULi M1695 ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail

Newegg.com - OCZ Value Series 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 667 (PC2 5400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail

Quote: Originally Posted by THRiLL KiLL Newegg.com - AMD Athlon 64 X2 3600+ Windsor 2.0GHz 2 x 256KB L2 Cache Socket AM2 Processor - Retail Newegg.com - ASRock 939Dual-VSTA Socket 939 ULi M1695 ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail Newegg.com - OCZ Value Series 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 667 (PC2 5400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail

I had one of those ASRock boards, good buy for the money. AGP and SLI if it is the one I am thinking of. Checked out the link, and it is the one I had. Good upgrade board.

E

Quote: Originally Posted by Fred_G I had one of those ASRock boards, good buy for the money. AGP and SLI if it is the one I am thinking of. Checked out the link, and it is the one I had. Good upgrade board. E

i messed up...
Newegg.com - MSI K9MM-V Socket AM2 VIA K8M800 Micro ATX AMD Motherboard - Retail

supports am2 / ddr2 / agp

ever heard of overclocking?

My two sempron 754 processors have run 2.8GHZ (one drives it daily) and the other putts along at 2.5GHz daily. If you need some tips let me know, but a 3000+ isn't a dead CPU.

By the way the athlon 64 chips (single core) came out in the 754 lineup. the 3200+ was a nice chip and the cache will get you a noticable gain in everything (being that you are used to the sempron.)

Hit me up in a PM if you have any questions. depending on the core and motherboard, that chip has potential.

Don't yell at me if i missed something somewhere but . . . when you say you have an amd 3000 is that a sempron or athlon? Also what motherboard are you using? It is quite possible to squeeze out a good deal of performance from what you are currently using. Overclocking can help you out, but tuning the system and giving it a once over might yield insight to other bottlenecks.

I would start with cpu-z and make certain the specs shown match your gear. One mobo I have automatically uses a memory divider when clock speeds or timing settings would normally cause it to fail to boot. Turning off auto for the dram speed setting cured that plague for me.

Also make certain your memory timings are as tight as they should be. Many times memory can boot with tighter than advertised timings; yet many mobo's will boot with very relaxed timings until they are manually set. If your mobo doesn't allow you to adjust memory timings, perhaps a program like memset could help you out.

There are dozens of people here who are expert overclockers/system tweakers and should be able to walk you through anything you need help with.

If all else fails my friend just replaced his 3700+ clawhammer (2.4GHZ 1MB cache) with a core2duo (and one of MY mobos . . . .) and may be willing to part with it. However I don't think simply dropping in a CPU will cure your problems without some tweaking. Let me see if he will let me mess with his old hardware and I'll get back to you with some results.

Hey thanks for all the additional help guys! I don't have the time to write up a very detailed post as of right now... I have work in about 15 minutes and I'm still in my underwear! Here's my hardware to get ya'll started:

AMD Athlon 64 3000+
2Gb Value Ram (1Gb Ultra 2 x 512Mb, 1Gb Corsair)
ASUS K8Vse Deluxe
PowerColor x1950Pro
Ultra 500W PSU

My processor is an Athlon, if that helps... and I know overclocking is an option. I OC'ed it before but got corrupted windows files only after 200Mhz into my OC... I think due to my value ram. My mobo doesn't have any RAM timing settings. I'd be willing to play with OC'ing a bit more as long as I have you guys to help... but I gotta jet, I'll post more later. Keep up the good work fellas!

ADD: @Socrus - Thanks for the offer! If I'm not mistaken, weren't the 3700+ Clawhammer cores based on the FX chip?

Quote: Originally Posted by Jobistober Hey thanks for all the additional help guys! I don't have the time to write up a very detailed post as of right now... I have work in about 15 minutes and I'm still in my underwear! Here's my hardware to get ya'll started: AMD Athlon 64 3000+ 2Gb Value Ram (1Gb Ultra 2 x 512Mb, 1Gb Corsair) ASUS K8Vse Deluxe PowerColor x1950Pro Ultra 500W PSU My processor is an Athlon, if that helps... and I know overclocking is an option. I OC'ed it before but got corrupted windows files only after 200Mhz into my OC... I think due to my value ram. My mobo doesn't have any RAM timing settings. I'd be willing to play with OC'ing a bit more as long as I have you guys to help... but I gotta jet, I'll post more later. Keep up the good work fellas! ADD: @Socrus - Thanks for the offer! If I'm not mistaken, weren't the 3700+ Clawhammer cores based on the FX chip?

that's not a v-series PSU is it?

That Ram is actuall pretty good, the ultra 512 sticks i have have hit DDR450 at 3-3-3-3 which is pretty benificial over there stock 25-3-3-9.

Other wise i'm researching the motherbord

EDIT: seems BA did a review on that board here at apex. who would have thought. Seems he had issues Overclocking with it. and it seems the NB was fixed and replaced by the nForce 3 250, but its always worth a shot, a few other reviews had better luck overclocking.

Quote: Originally Posted by s1ugh34d that's not a v-series PSU is it? That Ram is actuall pretty good, the ultra 512 sticks i have have hit DDR450 at 3-3-3-3 which is pretty benificial over there stock 25-3-3-9. Other wise i'm researching the motherbord EDIT: seems BA did a review on that board here at apex. who would have thought. Seems he had issues Overclocking with it. and it seems the NB was fixed and replaced by the nForce 3 250, but its always worth a shot, a few other reviews had better luck overclocking.

I don't believe the PSU is a v-series... it's just a dis-continued generic mdoel that came with the case... Model No. WIN-500S or something like that.

I want to give OC'ing a shot, just for curiosity in whether or not I can get a stable OC at all. My prime concern, and kinda scares me, is the threat of loosing my windows install if my system can take it. Could chaning the RAM timings via memset prevent this? Or is the OC'ing solely limited by my mobo? Otherwise, how much of a difference would getting an Athlon 64 3700+ have on my system? Considerable, or marginal?

Quote: Originally Posted by Jobistober I don't believe the PSU is a v-series... it's just a dis-continued generic mdoel that came with the case... Model No. WIN-500S or something like that. I want to give OC'ing a shot, just for curiosity in whether or not I can get a stable OC at all. My prime concern, and kinda scares me, is the threat of loosing my windows install if my system can take it. Could chaning the RAM timings via memset prevent this? Or is the OC'ing solely limited by my mobo? Otherwise, how much of a difference would getting an Athlon 64 3700+ have on my system? Considerable, or marginal?

Well to start off, do you have a random HDD laying around that you can install XP and nothing else on, just for testing stability and making sure you don't loos data. I always do this when testing new hardware, i even made my own nLite WinXP cd for benching exclusivly, and have one floating hard drive for all my bench setups.

As for Overclocking, getting a 64 3700+ is going to do this. You have a sempron 3000+ you can overclock it (guesstimate, depending on the board) to around 2.5GHz. Buying a 3700+ you start at 2.4GHz, you might get 2.6 GHZ out of it. The dollar value is in the sempron. One thing that would be nice would be the lager cache. I would try and find a 3200+ athlon 64, or 3000+, both that can be had for under 40$.

With those i would find a nice Motherboard. the one you have we can try an overclock with it, but i have the strangest feeling that it wouldn't show the performance that a nice MSI K8N Neo Platinum or ASUS K8N-E Deluxe. I have to go to school i add more latter

You should have upgraded the rest of your system before buying a video card. Sell everything and get an AM2 setup. It's really cheap right now, go look at the prices. For 59dollars you can get a 3600+ brisbane 65nm dual core, and DDR2 is like 34bucks for XMS2 1gb stick. You can't beat that.

You also will have the ability to upgrade to a lot newer stuff, like PCI-E for instance.

If I were you I would try to sell that rig. Upgrading it is like a waste of money(no offense), since newer stuff is cheaper.

Quote: Originally Posted by turbopsi You should have upgraded the rest of your system before buying a video card. Sell everything and get an AM2 setup. It's really cheap right now, go look at the prices. For 59dollars you can get a 3600+ brisbane 65nm dual core, and DDR2 is like 34bucks for XMS2 1gb stick. You can't beat that. You also will have the ability to upgrade to a lot newer stuff, like PCI-E for instance. If I were you I would try to sell that rig. Upgrading it is like a waste of money(no offense), since newer stuff is cheaper.

Thats a good idea too. But a nice OCing motherboard would be a little more, and the whole upgrade would cost around as much as that upgraded AGP card.

A nice overclocked 754 system, running a agp card wil o fine for the work and stuf job does. I mean for 40$ he could get a realy quick Overeclocked system running one hell of a graphics setup. AGP is bottlenecked in itself. Unless you get a core duo AGP board, thats when you have true ultimate power in the AGP market...

Well, I just got done testing out the x1950 some more. Instead of just benching it, I ran some games to test it out for real. I had HL2 and Doom3 video settings maxed out (at 1024x768 res) and the games ran pretty smooth... never dropping below about 25 fps. Maybe it's not as bottlenecked as I thought? Thoughts?